--:-- Host: I didn't realize how terrible I was at sales until, at 27 years old, I was sitting in my father-in-law's office listening to him fire me. Selling him on why I should keep my job and why it was in the best interest of him, the company, and myself to do so was one of the all-time best sells of my career. Now, what we're going to talk about today are the psychological principles that came out of that conversation that I've implemented over multiple sales teams throughout my career and led to 12 years later when I founded my own company writing 1,200 commercial insurance accounts in less than three years during COVID on an 80% plus close ratio across the board from every sales rep in the company. Today, we are going to discuss those psychological principles, what they are, their impact, and how you can implement them into your business. Let's go.
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--:-- Host: In a crude laboratory in the basement of his home. What is up, guys, and welcome back to the show. We have a phenomenal conversation for you today where I'm going to break down six psychological concepts that you can implement into your sales process today. These are simple, easy concepts. However, most salespeople are not taught these. It's not that you can't do them. It's not that you're not able or that I have any kind of superpowers. I promise you there is not a natural sales bone in my body. Every bit of my sales success over a 20-year career, not only personally, but also teaching this to the teams that I was either an executive over or were part of companies that I have founded and sold, I have had to learn the hard way through boots on the ground, battle tested, putting words out into the market, using different phrases, using different timing, using different psychological tactics in order to figure out what worked best. What were the set of tumblers that you needed to use in order to unlock more sales? This is really great stuff. Number six is one that is going to blow you away. It is one that so many sales professionals don't actually think that they can provide. And we're going to talk about how you can use that sixth psychological principle, regardless of what business you're in, regardless of what type of product or service you are selling.
--:-- Host: Before we get there, I also want to make a big announcement. My Master of the Clothes sales course is now officially available. If you go to masteroftheclothes.com, this is the inbound process, step-by-step, broken out, with a downloadable script with breakdowns of all the psychological principles used that you can print out and have on your desk. This is literally a template, a guide, a word-for-word, step-by-step process that you can have right in front of you on every single call to make sure that you are going through the process in the right order, that you are hitting what I call kill shots, phrases that lock your customers in, gathering the right information, and ultimately delivering back to them a proposal that they can't say no to. Go to masteroftheclothes.com, and as a listener to this show, if you put in the show 50, the show 50, I'll have a link in the show notes, whether you're listening or watching on YouTube, you go to masteroftheclothes.com, type in the show 50 for a $50 discount on the course. I give that to you guys because I love you for being listeners to this show.
--:-- Host: All right, so let's get into what we're going to talk about today. These six psychological concepts. So what I have found over the course of my career is that most sales die because we are focusing on the wrong things. Specifically, we're trying to come up with a pitch and no one wants to be pitched. Nobody. There's no one in the world who is like, you know, I just can't wait to have someone pitch me something today. Now, granted, if you're a VC investor or maybe being pitched by startups is part of your job, but that's different than being pitched to buy something. Now, in order to maximize our close ratio, we have to forget about the pitch and go to the psychology of the person who is buying from you. We have to dig into what they need to hear, what they're trying to solve, what they're trying to get out of a conversation with you in order to close the deal. If we just hit them with some standard pitch that you get out of some antiquated sales process or playbook, you're going to lose sales. You're never gonna maximize your close ratio because every individual is different. So we need to develop a process that is malleable to each different type of customer or buying persona that we may interact with day-to-day, week-to-week, month-to-month throughout our career.
--:-- Host: In order to do this, so when I say we got to get rid of the pitch, it means we also have to get rid of all the other sales shiny object syndrome issues that I come across and that we all have to deal with in our own lives, right? Which is, you know, the next email drip campaign with the perfect subject hooks or, you know, DM sales strategy or the wedge in and make them feel terrible about their previous buying decisions or some standard, ordinary, generic set of discovery questions. These things are never going to get you there. We have to sculpt our process to the unique psychology of the buyer that we're talking to. And we're never going to truly know that until we get on the phone with them. So we need to have a process that is malleable to their buying persona, to their buying process, a process that we can adopt over and over. We need a system that is going to allow us to adapt how we interact with that customer based on the feedback that we are getting in real time. And that's what I teach at the Master of the Clothes.
--:-- Host: The six psychological principles we're going to talk about today, you can use them. We do go deeper in the course into how these actually apply. But I want to make sure I get these in front of you, because even if you do not decide to go through the Master of the Close course, implementing these psychological principles into your current sales process will immediately increase your close ratio, immediately. I absolutely guarantee that if you start to implement these, you will sell more business.
--:-- Host: So let's get into the meat and potatoes here. Our first psychological principle actually encompasses two, that is active listening and emotional labeling. Sales do not start with talking. They start with listening. Frankly, the entire process should be listening, particularly the beginning and the end, but especially the beginning. We need to listen. We need to be quiet. And a simple conversational opening like, what's going on? How can I help? and then going silent and letting them fill that void with all the things that got them to reach out to you or fill out a form or whatever, however you began your interaction with them. There's a quote from Stephen Covey. Most people do not listen with the intent to understand. They listen with the intent to reply. And this is where the psychological principle of active listening comes in. It means you are not listening to what they're saying so that you can then just barf your benefits on them. You're listening to hear what their problems actually are. Salespeople who actively listen during calls see a 19% increase in closing rates. 19%. One out of five. You're going to close one more deal for every five that you talk to if you just implement active listening. That's all you need to do. Just actively listen. Just make sure that you are not interrupting them, you're not barfing benefits on them. And you will see a 19% increase in your closing ratio.
--:-- Host: One of the largest accounts that I ever wrote in my commercial insurance agency happened because this was something that was standard in our process. We had a customer fill out a form on our website, and they were requesting what is a relatively simple, straightforward, and relatively low-cost insurance product that they were looking for. And instead of reaching out to them and immediately trying to solve the problem that they had filled out the form for, I reached out to them, introduced myself, and I asked, what's going on? How can I help? And they then barfed seven different problems that they were having on me. Seven, which is way beyond the norm. Normally we find you get two to three problems that the customer will give you that are pertinent and high priority on their brain. They had seven. And to my sales benefit, I had a product that could solve all seven of those benefits. And over the course of that conversation, listening and digging in, and we'll get to some of the other psychological principles that we use in a second, I was able to sell that person seven different products and it was an enormous sale and it came out of a form fill. And the only reason I knew that they had seven problems and not one problem was because I asked them a very simple, open-ended question. What's going on? How can I help? And then I just listened to them explain all the issues that they were having day to day with their insurance program.
--:-- Host: I lead with this principle because it is so incredibly powerful. It's probably the most powerful psychological principle that you can use in sales. Active listening. Open to any questions. Listen, not with the intent to reply, but with the intent to understand.
--:-- Host: Principle number two, paraphrase and confirm for trust. This, again, is bringing in two different psychological principles, tactical empathy and cognitive dissonance reduction, which is a mouthful. And this is a very, very simple principle to follow. After you're done listening, you may be taking notes on what their problems are. Paraphrase back to your prospect what you heard and have them confirm that the things you heard are the real problems. What it does, it shows that you care. It shows that you understand. It shows that you're there to add value, not just push product. Because what most sales professionals will do after they hear the problems is they'll start solving the problems. And they haven't yet confirmed whether they truly understand what those problems are or not. This is a high trust, high respect psychological principle. This will drive immediate connection to your prospect. Ernest Hemingway has a quote on this. When people talk, listen completely. Most never listen, right? Listen to hear the problems. Listen to everything they have to say. Do not interrupt them. Do not try to solve their problems. Do not barf benefits on them. Listen and then paraphrase and confirm.
--:-- Host: 73% of prospects say they trust a salesperson when they demonstrate a clear understanding of their challenges. So trust goes up for 73% of prospects when they believe that you truly understand what their challenges are. And it is simple as paraphrasing and having them confirm. And they may say, well, that's not exactly it. That's great. Now you're really digging into what the true problem is. And keep paraphrasing and confirming until you know what the problems are and they have confirmed that those are the real problems. Very, very powerful. Paraphrase and confirm. This is a step that so many sales professionals forget. And it is dynamic. It's incredible what you get out of people when they say, you know, when you do this, When you paraphrase and confirm, you will oftentimes hear the prospect like audibly relax, like you'll lean back in their chair or they'll exhale or like you can just some they'll make some sound will come through the phone that you can tell that like you've taken stress off their shoulders because for the first time they finally feel like someone is listening to them and understands the things that they're trying to get done with whatever it is that you're selling. It's absolutely incredible.
--:-- Host: All right, principle number three, silence sells. The principle here in practice is the power of the pause, right? These are strategic silences. What I like to say is shut up. Salespeople talk way too much. And when you're talking, there's no space for your customer or prospect to share what the actual problems are. Like you have to create space for them to tell you what is going on, what their fears are, what their concerns are, what obstacles they faced before, what their previous experiences with products like yours. These are all keys to closing a deal and being a true value provider. But if we're constantly blabbing away and trying to look smart and make ourselves feel good because we've been in the business for this long or we have this many vendors that we carry or here's what our client list looks like or here's how I would solve that problem. Your customer doesn't care. They're on the phone with you because they believe that you can solve their problem. They don't need to know your resume. Be quiet. Silence sells. It's absolutely the number one skill that I will, being silent is one of the absolute hardest skills for salespeople to master because we've been taught for so long incorrectly that we have to have this great pitch and hook them with this line and create a gap of value and then fill that gap with our product and all these other stupid sales tricks that just do not work long-term. And they certainly don't allow you to maximize your close ratio when if you would just shut the up, you would sell so much more.
--:-- Host: There's a quote from Peter Drucker. The most important thing in communication is hearing what isn't said. And if we are talking, we will never hear because it will never be said. Strategic pauses during sales calls improve prospect engagement by up to 26% as they process and self-persuade. I'm going to say that again. As they self-persuade, if you can be silent and use silence as a weapon, as a sales weapon, right, that prospect will talk themselves into working with you as they define and redefine what the problem truly is. And all you have to do is be quiet. And it's right there for the taking. So the next time you jump on a call, right, instead of coming back in with a solution, just be quiet for an extra second and see if they don't fill that void with more information. Now, you don't want to be weird or awkward about it. Take some skill over time, developing skills here that you know when too much silence is too much. But the longer you can be quiet and not fill that void, your prospect will. And most often they will fill it with valuable information that you can use to come up with a better product offering and ultimately align your proposal back to them in a way that resonates, is relevant, and solves the particular problems that they have reached out to you to solve. But if you're filling that void with your voice, you're never going to know.
--:-- Host: Sales principle number four, future pacing for commitment. Now, we're going to take you all the way to the end of the process here that we teach at Master of the Clothes, which is asking a very simple question. What would make this relationship a success to you? Now, this question doesn't have to be at the end. It could be towards the beginning if that was important to you or you tested it and found that it worked better for you there. I always found that ending a call with that question provided the most value to me in gathering additional information as well as setting a tone for what is to come after as well as setting a tone for what is to come after we finish our conversation, especially the initial conversation. So the psychological principles here are future pacing and autonomy preservation. All these principles are mouthfuls. But what it's doing is it's empowering the prospect to visualize working with you and working with you successfully, right? They're now in their brain when you ask this question, they're thinking, well, what would it look like? And when they visualize a high quality, valuable, successful relationship with you, their brain doesn't know the difference between the visualization and reality. So now they're starting to convince their brain that working with you is going to be successful. And if they give you some valuable nuggets, you now know what you need to do to be successful in a relationship with them. Stephen Covey, again, begin with the end in mind, right? We are beginning the relationship, this first call with our customer. We are beginning the relationship, this first call with our prospect by having them imagine the end.
--:-- Host: Future pacing increases prospect commitment by 33%. So think about this. If we use active listening, which increases close ratio by 19%, and we use future pacing, 33% increase in close, we are now at 52% increase in close ratio just by sandwiching our initial prospect call with an open-ended question that gets them talking and then closing that conversation with another open-ended question, which asks them to imagine the future. 52% increase in close ratio, just from those two principles alone. So the next time you get to the end of a call, very simply ask your prospect, hey, I have one more question for you. What would make this relationship successful for you? Try it. What you get out of it is going to be incredible. I mean, And I've had people say things to me like, oh, my God, I've never been asked that question before. Or, geez, let me think about that. Or, you know, man, if you just had a way that in 911 type situations, I could reach out to someone and knew they were going to pick up the phone. Man, that would make everything OK. Right. And they're giving me the things that are important to them. And if I believe that I can make good on those things, I now can present them back to them in a proposal and they've told me it's exactly what they want. I'm not guessing at what they want. I'm not hoping that what I present is what they want. They've literally told me exactly what they want. And again, if I'm able to provide it, I can put it in a proposal and know it's going to be valuable to them.
--:-- Host: Future pacing is a killer. All right. Psychological principle number five, trust through transparency. The exact principles are reciprocity and information symmetry. By giving all the details up front, we reduce fear and create goodwill. So the core idea here is we want to share everything about the process. There is no industry, no business in which we are the gatekeepers to information. That day has come and gone, right? They can chat GPT, they can Google, they can Claude, they can wherever their preferred research venue is find out just about everything that you know about the business outside of your personal experience. So by gatekeeping information or gatekeeping steps in the process or gatekeeping your quote unquote secret sauce from a prospect, all you're doing is creating a gap in trust. You're not being coy, not being clever. You're not adding suspense. You're creating a gap in trust. Quote from John Gisram, transparency, honesty, kindness, good stewardship, and even humor work in businesses at all times. 82% of buyers say they are more likely to purchase when the salesperson provides complete transparency about products and pricing.
--:-- Host: How we've done this and how we teach it is by simply giving our prospects everything that we get. Now, in insurance, that looks like, you know, as an insurance agent or broker, you are not actually selling a product that comes from your company. You are an agent or a broker. So you are sourcing products from other vendors in this place, in this case, insurance carriers. and then you are providing them in, you know, kind of packaged up in the way that best suits your prospect. Now, what that looks like is taking, say, the actual proposals that come from the vendors, even if they're ugly, even if they're messy, even if they're dot matrix style and showing them to the prospect as part of your proposal, because what that does, it shows true transparency. They are getting everything you get. There's nothing that you're hiding behind a curtain. Now, I know that a lot of us want to take what we get from our vendors or from our product team even and package them up into fancy portfolio proposals with graphics and logos and charts. And it looks super great, except it doesn't feel real. It feels like you manufactured it. So what we found, and again, this is over thousands and thousands of prospects that I've worked with just in my own business, not to mention all the sales teams that I worked with in the previous 15 years of my career. This idea is very foreign because we want to make it ours. We want to brand it us. None of that matters. They don't care about your brand. Your prospect doesn't care about your brand. They have a problem and they want it solved. And they are hoping that you are the person that can solve that problem. And if you can say, here is my solution, here is why I recommend it, And here are the exact details of the products that I am selling you in the way that I get them. Your prospects will appreciate that. They will. It will be a pattern disrupt for them because no one else does that. And it will ultimately build that trust bind that you need to maximize your close ratio.
--:-- Host: Our sixth and final psychological principle. And this is the one that I teased out at the front because this principle I'm about to give you a lot of sales professionals that I've worked with. They'll tell me that, well, we can't do that with our product. We can't. We don't have that ability to use that type of psychological principle in our business. And that's 100 percent not true. And I'm going to explain to you how and why. So the psychological principle at face value is the red velvet rope effect. The actual principles are scarcity and exclusivity. By limiting options, we create triggers for desire. Now, you may be saying, Ryan, I don't have any ability to limit options. Well, what you can do and what we teach is a very simple framework for doing so that creates psychological principle number six, our final principle. This is the principle that I teased out at the beginning of the show because so many the sales professionals that have either worked on teams that I've been on or that I've consulted with or coached, they'll tell me, well, we can't do that here. We don't have this ability to provide that type of, to use that tactic in our business. And that's a hundred percent not true. Every sales professional in every business has the ability to use this psychological principle. So what is that principle? It's the red velvet rope effect. We're creating scarcity and exclusivity. Now, how do we do that? Well, if you actually have a limited number of products or a limited time offer, et cetera, then those are kind of easy and very common scarcity and exclusivity plays. But I want to give you a high level play that you can make, that you can use, that is honest and real, but works with every product, every service in every market.
--:-- Host: Now we don want to oversell this principle And this is another mistake that a lot of sales professionals will make They will try to oversell the red velvet rope They try to make it seem like you know it is this amazing incredible thing And if only and blah, blah, blah. And again, that feels to use card sales. It feels it feels like they're being gimmicked. It feels like you're you're just trying to play them. That's not how we want to do this. So how I teach it in the master of the clothes and how I would recommend you use this principle is in a casual and conversational way. You say something to the effect of, once you've heard what their problems are and potentially what solution, you know, and in your mind, you kind of have an idea of what solutions might be available. You say something to the effect of, I have three markets. I have three products. I have three vendors, whatever relates to your particular business that I know could potentially work for you. In insurance, I'd say, I know there are three insurance carriers that will write your business. I know for sure. And then here's the hook. There is one in particular that I really hope we can get you into, but I won't know until I get your information back. Because up until this point, we haven't asked for revenue or whatever the numbers are that you need, how old you are, or whatever those demographic or firmographic information is that you need in order to actually provide them with a proposal. We haven't asked any of that yet. What we're doing is letting them know by saying we have three markets, three products, three vendors, etc. that I know could potentially work is that we know the marketplace. We're aware of what the marketplace is. We're experienced. We're committed. We understand what the marketplace is. And by then saying there is one in particular that I really hope we get you into. that I really hope we can match for you by saying there's one product, one service, one market, one vendor in particular that I hope we get you into, but we won't know until we get your information back. It's simple. It's easy. It's low pressure, right? They don't have to make any upfront commitments to get in, right? You're not hooking them. They don't have to make a down payment on something. You're telling them, once I get a better understanding of the exact details of your business or your personal life, whatever I need, whatever information I need specifically, once I get that information, I know I have a solution and there's one solution that's kick-ass that I really hope we get you into. And that creates the red velvet rope effect. it makes that prospect feel like, oh, I could be special. There might be a special thing out there for me. There might be something out there that I've never heard of that actually works better than anything I could have imagined, right? They start rolling around in their head all these amazing scenarios that you potentially could provide for them. And again, if somehow you can't come up with the best fit, whatever, I mean, that's all part of selling, right? Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose. But the idea here is that prospect is hooked in and now waiting. They're salivating for your proposal because they know that there could potentially be a special solution in there that you're going to provide to them that solves their problems and reduces all their concerns. And that's all you're trying to do as a salesperson. You're trying to make that feel that prospect feel good about doing business with you and purchasing the products, services that you offer.
--:-- Host: The quote on this one that I pulled out, people want exclusivity. Everyone loves a VIP pass. That's from Gary Vaynerchuk. Offers framed with exclusivity are 2.3x more likely to convert than standard offers. Now, I would say that that's 100% true. I think for most of us who aren't selling, say, e-books online, right, we can't do that in a super salesy, super high pressure commitment based way, right? That is why the more casual low pressure way in which, you know, I'm recommending you create the red velvet rope effect in your sales process, I believe probably produces an even higher return than 2.3 X because the prospect is now imagining this great thing. They don't have to commit to the great thing before they see your proposal back. Very, very, very powerful.
--:-- Host: So guys, this process that I've described in the psychological principles that we've gone through here, these are battle tested over a 20 year sales career. I've run multiple sales teams in technology and fitness and insurance. I started and founded my own commercial digital insurance agency. We're writing hundreds of accounts a month. That's how we were able to write so many accounts in three years that we were ultimately acquired. Our growth trajectory was so high because of this process. And we battle tested, we battle tested every word and every principle. And I'm telling you literally down to sentences, we would put things in, take them out, test which sales reps were using which scripts, which sales reps were using which process, where we were getting the highest return. And, you know, these core principles came out as the defining principles that had to be in the process. There are other things you can say. There are other things you can do for sure. But if you skip these six psychological principles, you will be leaving an opportunity for your prospect to back out. What we found is that for a product that everybody hates, like insurance, right? Everybody hates insurance. No one is dying to buy an insurance policy. for insurance, we had people like literally salivating to get our proposal. They were like, like, Hey, when's it going to come? When's it going to come? And that would be like hours after we talked to them, even though we told them it might come two days to get back to them. Crazy, just crazy stuff. But it all comes down to listening, understanding, confirming, building in trust and ultimately creating that red velvet rope experience that locks them in, that gets them imagining what the future could be working with you. Their problem's gone, their challenge is solved, and they have someone that they can trust long-term to solve their problems in whatever particular venue it is that you're solving them over the lifetime of their need for it.
--:-- Host: Mastering sales is, guys, it's not about pushing product. Yes, you have to do the work. Yes, you have to make the calls. Yes, you have to create the content. Yes, you have to create the ads, whatever your way of generating opportunities is. You have to do that stuff. But if you then take those lead capture processes, that lead demand generation, and then you push product down people's face, sure, you're going to sell 10, 15, 20%. But if you want to close 80%, if you want to take your sales career to a whole nother level, you have to get out of pushing product and get into understanding psychology. And that's what I hope I've broken down for you today and given you some great ideas. One more time, if you want the exact process that we created that is applicable to any industry, use it in tech, use it in fitness, use it in insurance, over 20 years, go to masteroftheclothes.com and enter the show 50 and you'll get a $50 off the course. It's a one-time payment. Love for you to check it out. If you have questions, leave them in the comments. If you haven't subscribed to the show yet, please do. If you're watching on YouTube, hit the like button. If you're listening on Spotify or Apple Podcasts, whatever, leave a rating, leave a review. That helps more people find this content, helps people more find the work that I'm trying to do here to help you guys grow, helps us build our community. I love you guys for being here. Go out and kick ass. This is the way.
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--:-- Narrator: In a crude laboratory in the basement of his home. It's 3 a.m.
