--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Big Monday in America. Amy Klobuchar kicked things off by subtweeting the incoming president.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So, as we inaugurate a new president and vice president, let us remember that the power of those in this room comes from the people.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: President Trump was surrounded by his best tech bros, one of whom would later in the day do a few Sieg Heil's.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Thank you. After the speeches, the flags were raised at the White House and the Capitol building. RIP, RIP Jimmy Carter. Thank you, fellow citizens, and farewell.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And the president signed a bunch of executive orders, first at the arena. Could you imagine Biden doing this? I don't think so.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And then back at the White House. What is this? Withdrawing from the World Health Organization, sir. Ooh, that's a big one.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Back in executive action on Today Explained. Support for this show comes from ServiceNow.
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--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Bing, bing, bing, bong, bong, bong, bong, bing. Today explained Sean Rameswaram from here on January 21st, the day after many executive orders signed by our once and once again President Donald Trump.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: Andrew Prokop, senior political correspondent at Vox, is here to help us work through them.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Andrew, what did we learn yesterday?
--:-- Andrew Prokop: We learned that Trump is really going for it. He's coming out of the gate with an extremely aggressive, dubiously legal agenda on many fronts, most notably immigration, but other issues as well.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And then I think we also learned some other things, which is that on certain issues, he may not be exactly sure himself what he's going to do. Fun.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: OK, let's start with their big swings. Where did they focus their day one attention?
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So probably the big headline from the day was Trump's massive, wide-ranging pardon of the January 6th rioters.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: And this is something, you know, everyone knew Trump was going to do something like this. It had been discussed at length.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: But only a few days before Trump's inauguration, Vice President J.D. Vance went on TV and said that if you committed violence on that day, obviously you shouldn't be pardoned.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: And there's a little bit of a gray area. Trump does not share that opinion, evidently.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And he went far more aggressive.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: First, we have a list of pardons and commutations relating to events that occurred on January 6th, 2021. Okay, and how many people is this?
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: I think this order will apply to approximately 1,500 people, sir.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: So this is January 6th? What he did was that he just separated everyone into one of two groups.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: First, he singled out 14 people who had been members of far-right groups, the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers, who were really actively plotting and were convicted of seditious conspiracy.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: For those guys, he didn't give them a full pardon, but he did commute their sentences and free them from prison if they were in prison.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Then the other group is everyone else who was involved in other crimes at the Capitol on that day.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: Trump said, you are fully pardoned. So this is really a full-blown Trump endorsement and defense of the violence at the Capitol on January 6th, 2021.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: His defenders always said, oh, he didn't really mean for that to happen. Now he's making it unmistakably clear.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: He thought that was good and those people are good and he is going to protect them from any consequences.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: OK, so pardoning everyone from the January 6th incident, you know, predictable or surprising, depending on your perspective.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: There was a whole lot of other stuff he did, including on immigration, which I want to get to eventually.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: But in the meantime, tell us about some of the other themes of day one.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: Well, energy and climate and the environment was a very big theme.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Trump really came out of the gate hot on energy as well.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: That is why today I will also declare a national energy emergency. We will drill, baby, drill.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: He withdrew the U.S. from the Paris Climate Agreement.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: The next item here is the withdrawal from the Paris Climate Treaty.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: He issued a pretty sweeping executive order calling for the rollback of a bunch of Biden administration policies, including what Trump calls the electric vehicle mandate.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: It's not really a mandate, but, you know, certain fuel efficiency standards that would ease the transition to electric vehicles.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Trump said, nope, that's going away.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: We will be a rich nation again, and it is that liquid gold under our feet that will help to do it.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: With my actions today, we will end the Green New Deal and we will...
--:-- Andrew Prokop: He put a halt on wind energy permitting.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So we have more oil and gas than any country in the world, and we're going to use it.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: We're not going to do the wind thing.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Wind, dude. Big, ugly windmills.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: He also opened up lots of new areas of Alaska to new fossil fuel production and wants to go from there.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So Trump wants to deprioritize climate change, boost fossil fuel production and make new projects of any kind really easier to build.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: OK. He also made a bunch of changes to how the government works, it seemed like.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Yes, so one of Trump and the people around him long-running regrets thoughts about how things went wrong in their first term is that they believe that the federal civil service bureaucracy was too anti was disobedient insubordinate did not want to implement his policies and that you know that why they failed in a lot of what they tried to do last time around.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: So they have been cooking up ideas for years about how to get, in their view, better control of this bureaucracy, which mainly amounts to making more positions, political jobs that are easier to hire without going through the civil service projects and making it easier to fire existing civil servants, either by reclassifying them as political jobs or just taking their protections away.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So Trump issued a series of orders that get at different parts of this.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: Sir, the next item, as you announced in your speech, is a requirement that federal workers return to full-time in-person work immediately.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: We didn't really see, you know, mass firings yet.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: There were a few firings reported, heads of immigration court systems.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: But this is, I think, laying the groundwork.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: It's a signal that they're very serious about this idea and that they really do intend on kind of taking a wrecking ball to the federal civil service as we know it.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: One high-profile firing you forgot to mention, Andrew.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: Vivek Ramaswamy. Yes. R.I.P. Vivek.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: The reality is many people are annoyed by my rise and believe that...
--:-- Andrew Prokop: We knew immigration orders were coming, Andrew. And come they did.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Tell us about what Trump tried to do on day one to overhaul our immigration system?
--:-- Andrew Prokop: I think the Trump team has the clearest idea of what they want to do on immigration than any other issue.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: This is one where Deputy White House Chief of Staff slash Homeland Security Advisor Stephen Miller is very clearly calling the shots and shooting for the moon.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: All illegal entry will immediately be halted and we will begin the process of returning millions and millions of criminal aliens back to the places from which they came.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: He is, in addition to restoring various policies from the first Trump administration, such as suspending refugee admissions, the Remain in Mexico policy, which has migrants have to stay in Mexico while their claims are being adjudicated.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: He also went much further in really aggressive and sweeping assertions of federal authority.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: He declared that there was still a public health emergency, even though the pandemic is long kind of over or accepted as a part of life, depending on who you ask.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: But basically using that as an excuse to start like totally ignoring U.S. asylum law.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And I will send troops to the southern border to repel the disastrous invasion of our country.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: He said he would now order the military to make defending the borders part of their main mission, something that has not been done before.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And he also issued an order which he claimed would suspend birthright citizenship, which is the constitutional protected right of any child born in America to be an American citizen.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: His team said, actually, we are not going to respect this anymore if both of a child's parents are not U.S. citizens or lawful permanent residents.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: They will not be citizens anymore.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: And so that applies to undocumented immigrants, but it also applies to visa holders, H-1B visa holders or student visa holders who have a child while in America.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Their children will not be American citizens unless one of the parents of the child is a U.S. citizen or lawful permanent resident.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: This seems clearly unconstitutional.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: It's already been the subject of a lawsuit by the ACLU.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: And many of Trump's other immigration orders and other orders will be the subject of lawsuits headed to the courts.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And, you know, we'll see what happens with those, whether this conservative Supreme Court stands up to Donald Trump and tries to enforce the rule of law or whether they are not so inclined to rein him in.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: Did he signal that he is going to need congressional support for any of these major initiatives, especially on immigration?
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Or did he signal that he wants to go it alone, both, something in the middle?
--:-- Andrew Prokop: He didn't really suggest anything.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: There is a border security bill under discussion in Congress, so he wants more money for the border, etc.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: But he did not make requests of Congress a main priority of this first day.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: It was all about executive power and trying to claim powers to make these vast changes through his own authority and no one else's.
--:-- Andrew Prokop: While the president was busy giving speeches and signing executive orders, Congress was voting on stuff too, including a big immigration bill with Trump's fingerprints all over it.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: That's up next on Today Explained.
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--:-- Nicole Norea: Nicole Norea, senior politics writer at Vox. Nicole, tell us about the Lakin-Riley Act.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So I think on its face, a lot of people might agree with its aims, which is to crack down on unauthorized immigration, particularly among people who have committed crimes.
--:-- Nicole Norea: Lakin-Riley's horrific murder should have never happened. She should still be with us today.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And if she was, as Senator Britt pointed out, she'd be turning 23 tomorrow.
--:-- Nicole Norea: The individual responsible was arrested not once, but twice, but was released by authorities in New York before an ICE detention.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: But this is really bad policy, and I'm not saying that in a partisan sense, but it really does not address the underlying issues with the U.S. immigration system.
--:-- Nicole Norea: If you actually look at the nitty-gritty of what's in it, there are two major prongs to this.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: One, it would create a mandatory detention requirement for undocumented immigrants accused of committing nonviolent crimes mostly related to theft.
--:-- Nicole Norea: The Lake and Raleigh Act requires ICE to detain illegal aliens who commit theft and shoplifting.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: The accused part of this is really important because they haven't been convicted.
--:-- Nicole Norea: They may not have been subject to sort of due process in the process of being accused.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: They could be accused not just in the U.S., but in another country, potentially.
--:-- Nicole Norea: That can lead to a whole host of problems that immigrant advocates have identified.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: This bill is so broadly drafted that it would compel law enforcement to put a mandatory detention on a—you heard it, an 11-year-old immigrant in New York accused of stealing a soda from a gas station.
--:-- Nicole Norea: But then, moving on to the other part of the bill, is this mechanism that would allow state attorneys general to sue the federal government to basically enforce the provisions of the bill, but also related to policies on visas and on detention.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Basically, it would lead to the courts getting gummed up and allow states a lot more say than they historically have had in terms of federal immigration policy.
--:-- Nicole Norea: There are reasons why that's bad, including the fact that there are reasons for sort of a unified federal policy around immigration.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And the fact that a lot of these states don't necessarily have the expertise to be able to deal with immigration enforcement and also foreign policy, because this is actually, you know, a matter of relations potentially with Mexico, with China.
--:-- Nicole Norea: This could lead to a lot of sticky situations in the courts.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: How much does this legislation cost?
--:-- Nicole Norea: Yeah, so I think that's a major problem with this bill, is that, first of all, if you're going to require that every undocumented immigrant accused of theft-related crimes can be detained, it's going to cost a lot of money to detain those people.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: ICE would need actually more than three times the current number of detention beds, a 265% increase for this bill.
--:-- Nicole Norea: It would need to execute 80 removal flights a week, almost double its current capacity.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: The new estimate from ICE is that the bill would cost $83 billion over the next three years if implemented.
--:-- Nicole Norea: On that basis, a lot of Democrats have severe doubts about it.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Like, where is that money going to come from?
--:-- Nicole Norea: We are now talking up to $83 billion for this legislation over the first three years to implement it.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: That's more than the annual budget for the entire Department of Homeland Security.
--:-- Nicole Norea: And not only that, I think beyond cost, there's a question of priorities for detaining certain immigrants.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So right now, as it stands under the Biden administration policy, they made a concerted effort to detain only people who were accused of violent crimes or who had a flight risk or who had recently come into the country.
--:-- Nicole Norea: There's a reason for that in that U.S. immigration enforcement has limited resources to carry out its mission.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And there's a question of should ICE really be prioritizing these people who might have been, I don't know, an example that an immigration attorney raised to me is a mother who was stealing baby formula.
--:-- Nicole Norea: Are we going to be locking that person up and also then raise the question of who's going to take care of her child?
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And obviously that's a sympathetic case, but that person would have to be detained under the Lake and Riley Act.
--:-- Nicole Norea: I'm sure there are a lot of Republicans in this country, Nicole, who would say, yes, if an undocumented immigrant comes into this country and then steals baby formula, yes, that mother should be detained.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: What's more interesting, I suppose, here is that there are a lot of Democrats also voting in support of this act and saying, yeah, sure, go for it.
--:-- Nicole Norea: So the first version passed the House pretty easily with the support of 48 Democratic House members.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And then last night, the Senate passed their version of it with 12 Democrats voting in support.
--:-- Nicole Norea: And now it goes to the House again for a final vote and then to President Trump's desk.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: The Senate has passed the Laken bill 64 that required a number of Democrats to vote with it
--:-- Nicole Norea: You know I think there an impulse among moderate Democrats in particular to support this bill partially because of the political fight we saw play out in 2024 around this
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: They're reflecting their constituents to some degree and reacting to that and hoping to address the border crisis.
--:-- Nicole Norea: But I think what's been lost in this narrative is that in trying to show that the Democratic Party is sort of a party that embraces law enforcement, They have abandoned the larger picture of what the problems in our immigration system actually are.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And I think this bill is in many ways sort of a distraction from those.
--:-- Nicole Norea: When you talk about the political realities of 2024 that might be driving Democrats to vote for legislation like this, what are we talking about exactly?
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Are we talking about just the fact that the Democrats kind of got shellacked or something else?
--:-- Nicole Norea: Yeah, I think there are a few things that have changed in the last few years in terms of the immigration debate in this country.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And I think one of them was a very successful Republican campaign to send migrants who are arriving on the border to blue cities.
--:-- Nicole Norea: Since the summer, our city's Office of Immigrant Affairs and the Office of Emergency Management have been gearing up for the potential arrival of asylum seekers via unplanned and uncoordinated bus routes from southern states, as we have seen in cities like New York and Washington, D.C.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: You know, in places like Philly, for example, and in New York, you know, we have Eric Adams talking about the city unable to sort of absorb these migrant populations and the stress that it's putting on local resources there in a way that they had never had to deal with that before.
--:-- Nicole Norea: This issue will destroy New York City. Destroy New York City. We're getting 10,000 migrants a month.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: I really think it made the problem real for Democrats in a way that it hadn't been before.
--:-- Nicole Norea: They then played into sort of this Republican narrative about chaos at the border.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Like, I think also the reality of the border change, there are now people not just coming from Mexico and Central America, but also from all over the world.
--:-- Nicole Norea: We're talking about, you know, China and Ukraine, people who are arriving at the southern border.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And the resources there just don't exist to process those people.
--:-- Nicole Norea: And that is a big problem.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: But I think Democrats have reacted to that by embracing sort of Trumpian and more right-wing immigration policies.
--:-- Nicole Norea: So I really do think that we've seen a shift in terms of the way that Democrats are talking about immigration in the last four years.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: How many more Lake and Riley acts do Republicans have up their sleeves?
--:-- Nicole Norea: I mean, this one was making its way through Congress before Donald Trump even took the oath of office on Monday.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: How many more chances do Republicans get to tweak our immigration system?
--:-- Nicole Norea: Well, I think that's sort of a matter of how many more chances do Democrats give them, because we really just didn't see that much pushback to this bill in a way that's kind of baffling, given where Democrats were four years ago.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Do as much as we can to make immigrants welcome in America, to make sure that America integrates immigrants into our system of government, And we'll keep fighting to get as bold and strong a bill as we can.
--:-- Nicole Norea: And, you know, I think we did see once it got to the Senate for debate that some Democrats were then suddenly raising objections to it and some of the sort of potential overreach of especially the provision around allowing state attorneys general to sue.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And the problems that would arise if every state and county and city, Mr. President, were to enforce its own immigration laws.
--:-- Nicole Norea: And that's why the Constitution.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: But, you know, that didn't really go anywhere at that point.
--:-- Nicole Norea: The ball was already rolling. The bill had momentum.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: But, you know, they're also facing the next four years of Trump and trying to at least feign an interest in working with him in Congress.
--:-- Nicole Norea: And it's a tough path for Democrats because they were just in power for four years.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And the American people very much want to see a change, not just in who's sitting in the White House, but in how we deal with immigration in this country.
--:-- Nicole Norea: Yes. We're now seeing anti-immigrant polling at their worst since the post-911 era, according to Gallup.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So there has been this major change in public sentiment.
--:-- Nicole Norea: I think there is a question in my mind about when we start seeing Trump roll out these aspects of his immigration platform like mass deportations or ending birthright citizenship.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Are those kinds of policies that are going to be very invasive in terms of American life, you know, you might see people being rounded up at their workplaces and their homes, are those kinds of policies going to create a political change among voters?
--:-- Nicole Norea: Are they going to react the same way that they might have during the family separation crisis when they saw kids in cages, in the miler blankets at the border in these temporary facilities, or when the travel ban was rolled out in the first week of Trump's first term?
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: All of those things did create a lot of backlash among Americans.
--:-- Nicole Norea: And I just don't know if that will still exist this time around.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And I think that's also part of a broader question I have around sort of liberal resistance.
--:-- Nicole Norea: Does it exist anymore?
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: I don't know.
--:-- Nicole Norea: I think like a lot of them have sort of laid down their mantle here.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Nicole Norea, Vox.
--:-- Nicole Norea: You can read her and Andrew at Vox.com.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Shoutouts to Daniela Diaz at Politico for her help with today's show too.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Peter Valadon-Rosen and Amanda Llewellyn produced, Amina Alsadi edited, Laura Bullard and Victoria Chamberlain kept us accurate, and Rob Byers and Andrea Christensdottir mixed this episode of Today Explained.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Thank you.
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