--:-- [Theme music fades out]
--:-- Noel King: Welcome to Today Explained. I'm Noel King.
--:-- Noel King: Yesterday, President Trump gave a eulogy for Charlie Kirk, and in it, he mentioned a big announcement coming tomorrow. He said it's going to be medically historic, and it's related to autism.
--:-- Noel King: Now, we're going to talk about that announcement and the controversy surrounding it. Joining me is Eric Budman, a reporter for STAT, an online magazine that covers science and medicine.
--:-- Eric Budman: Thanks for having me on the show.
--:-- Noel King: So, Eric, can you tell us what's going on with this announcement?
--:-- Eric Budman: Well, President Trump mentioned that he's going to make a big announcement tomorrow, and it's related to autism. And it's interesting because his HHS Secretary, Bobby, has spent years suggesting a link between vaccines and autism.
--:-- Noel King: That's right. And it's worth noting that last week, RFK Jr.'s hand-picked panel of vaccine experts met to update U.S. vaccine guidance. And honestly, it was not boring.
--:-- Eric Budman: [laughs] Yeah, it was a pretty chaotic meeting.
--:-- Noel King: [laughs] Sorry to prolong it. Let's get to the meat of it. So, Eric, can you tell us more about what happened at that meeting?
--:-- Eric Budman: So, the panel met last week, and by all accounts, it was pretty chaotic. There was some arguing and some fighting, and they even re-voted on an issue because members didn't fully understand the wording of what they were voting on.
--:-- Noel King: Wow, that sounds like a real mess. And what about the recommendations that came out of that meeting? What did they say about the COVID vaccine?
--:-- Eric Budman: So, for the COVID vaccine, they kind of walked back or narrowed the recommendation. Now, they're saying people above six months of age should talk with their doctors about whether it's right for them to get the vaccine.
--:-- Noel King: That's interesting. And what about the MMRV vaccine for kids? What did they recommend there?
--:-- Eric Budman: So, the panel recommended separating those vaccines, so getting them as two separate shots. And that was already something that the CDC had recommended because with whatever route you take, there's a low risk of febrile seizures.
--:-- Noel King: Okay, got it. And what about the hepatitis B vaccine for babies? What happened with that?
--:-- Eric Budman: So, there has been quite a lot of hubbub about the hepatitis B vaccine because some people have said, "Why do we need to give babies a vaccine for a disease that is transmitted sexually or through intravenous drug use?"
--:-- Noel King: That's a good point. And what about the timing of the vaccine? Did they make any changes there?
--:-- Eric Budman: So, there was a lot of discussion before this meeting about whether they should delay that recommendation, delay the age at which that vaccine was recommended. And ultimately, this committee decided, "We don't know that that's actually going to be more protective rather than harmful, so let's just keep the recommendation as is until we can vote at a later date."
--:-- Noel King: Okay, got it. And what about the trust in this committee? Is that starting to erode among public health experts?
--:-- Eric Budman: Yeah, I think so. The American Academy of Pediatrics has now broken with this committee, which is a pretty big deal. And, you know, they're recommending different things. And I think generally public health experts are wary of what this committee has to say.
--:-- Noel King: Okay, that's interesting. And what about the recommendations themselves? Do they matter a lot?
--:-- Eric Budman: Yeah, they can influence what vaccines get paid for by insurers, and I think there's a general sense that this committee is helping the nation as a whole understand what vaccines they should get.
--:-- Noel King: Alright, let's take a quick break. We'll be right back.
--:-- [Theme music plays]
--:-- Noel King: Welcome back to Today Explained. I'm Noel King.
--:-- Noel King: Joining me now is William Moss, a pediatrician by training, a specialist in infectious diseases, and a professor in the Department of Epidemiology here at the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health and the executive director of the International Vaccine Access Center.
--:-- William Moss: Thanks for having me on the show.
--:-- Noel King: So, William, let's talk about the history of vaccine schedules. When and why did we first start thinking that kids should be getting vaccines on this unified schedule?
--:-- William Moss: Yeah, so there's actually a long history of guidance on immunizations here in this country. And it's gotten obviously more complicated as more vaccines have been introduced. But you can trace it all the way back to the 1930s when the American Academy of Pediatrics started issuing guidance on childhood vaccines.
--:-- Noel King: Okay, got it. And what about the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices? When was that established?
--:-- William Moss: So, the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices was established in 1964.
--:-- Noel King: Okay, and what about the unified immunization schedule? When was that first issued?
--:-- William Moss: Yeah, so it was in 1995 that ACIP, the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices, kind of got together with the American Academy of Pediatrics and issued what is really considered kind of this first unified immunization schedule for children.
--:-- Noel King: Okay, that's interesting. And what about the differences in vaccine schedules across developed countries? Why do Denmark and the U.K. have different schedules for childhood vaccinations?
--:-- William Moss: Yeah so the way I would think about it is that there not one true you know the best immunization schedule These immunization schedules involve trade So for example you know one thing a big consideration is just the disease burden the epidemiology of a particular disease.
--:-- Noel King: Okay, got it. And what about the concerns that some parents have about the number of vaccines their kids are getting at once? Is there any room for improvement on our childhood vaccine schedules?
--:-- William Moss: Oh, I would certainly say not everything's being done exactly right, and there's always room for improvement. But what I'll emphasize is what's really important is that process by which the immunization schedule is reviewed and updated, that's so critical to making sure that good, sound decisions are being made and to enlist and ensure the trust in those decisions.
--:-- [Theme music plays]
--:-- Noel King: Thanks, William Moss, for joining us on the show.
--:-- William Moss: Thanks for having me.
--:-- Noel King: And thanks to our listeners for tuning in. If you want to support the show, you can become a Vox Member. Go to vox.com/members to learn more.
--:-- [Theme music continues to play as the episode ends]
