--:-- Noel King: Welcome to Today Explained. I'm Noel King here with Haley Britsky.
--:-- Haley Britsky: Thanks for having me on the show.
--:-- Noel King: Today, we're talking about the Pentagon's new policy on transgender service members. Haley, what does this new policy say exactly?
--:-- Haley Britsky: Individuals who have a diagnosis or history of gender dysphoria are no longer eligible to serve. As of today, it will henceforth be the official policy of the United States government that there are only two genders, male and female. All service members will identify as only either male or female, which the policy says is unchangeable during a person's life. And it says their pronouns must reflect that. And it also disqualifies the use of DOD funds for medical procedures and things like hormone therapy and other procedures related to gender transition and things like that.
--:-- Noel King: That's a pretty drastic change. Can you walk us through the exceptions that are laid out in the policy?
--:-- Haley Britsky: It lays out exceptions for individuals currently serving in the military who will be separated under this policy. It's a case-by-case basis of if a service member is kept in the military despite having a history or a diagnosis of gender dysphoria, if there is a government interest in keeping them in uniform because they directly support what they say is warfighting capabilities. It also says that there are other exceptions on if they have 36 months of stability in their sex and can demonstrate they've never attempted to transition and that they can adhere to the standards laid out in the military.
--:-- Noel King: So, it's not entirely clear how many people will be affected by this policy. Can you give us some numbers?
--:-- Haley Britsky: We heard last week a senior defense official told reporters that there were a little over 4,000 troops who'd been diagnosed with gender dysphoria across all three components. But it's worth noting that not all transgender people have a medical diagnosis of gender dysphoria.
--:-- Noel King: That's a good point. And what about the argument that being transgender somehow makes someone less deployable or less capable of serving in the military?
--:-- Haley Britsky: A lot of times what we hear is that this is tied to their deployability. Being transgendered in the military causes complications and differences. But a non-deployable status is not specifically tied to gender dysphoria or transgender individuals. So that's oftentimes one of the reasonings that they use. But what we see in the executive order and then in the Pentagon policy that resulted from it is they kind of go a step further than just focusing on the medical readiness of these individuals. They kind of hone in on their value system and morals by saying that individuals who have gender dysphoria or have been diagnosed with gender dysphoria, that they are inconsistent with the honesty, humility, and integrity that's required in the military.
--:-- Noel King: That's a pretty interesting point. And what about the incentives for service members to voluntarily separate from the military under this policy?
--:-- Haley Britsky: The memo says that if you elect to voluntarily separate within 30 days of that memo, you will get two times the separation pay as if you wait to be involuntarily separated. And separation pay is calculated on how long you've served in the military and what you were getting paid at the time of your separation.
--:-- Noel King: That's a pretty significant incentive. And what about the potential for legal challenges to this policy?
--:-- Haley Britsky: We're assuming there will be legal challenges and we're in an environment where it's hard to tell what a legal challenge might lead to. But during President Trump's first term, as I recall, there were legal challenges to some of what he tried in the Pentagon. The ACLU of Maryland filed a lawsuit challenging the president's ban on transgender individuals in the military.
--:-- Noel King: That's right. And what about the timeline for when these separations will start?
--:-- Haley Britsky: So it sounds like roughly 60 days before separations will officially begin within the military services.
--:-- Noel King: Welcome back to Today Explained. We're talking about the Pentagon's new policy on transgender service members. I'm Noel King here with Navy Petty Officer Sam Rodriguez.
--:-- Sam Rodriguez: Thanks for having me on the show.
--:-- Noel King: Sam, you're a transmasculine, non-binary service member in the US Navy. Can you tell us a little bit about your experience serving in the military?
--:-- Sam Rodriguez: I joined the Navy in 2015. I was selected for a clinical fellowship that I'm supposed to start this year. But now, with this new policy, I'm not sure if I'll be able to continue serving.
--:-- Noel King: That must be really tough for you. Can you walk us through what this policy means for you and your career?
--:-- Sam Rodriguez: I was selected for a clinical fellowship that I'm supposed to start this year. So that was to be a two-year intensive clinical fellowship to be a clinical social worker within the Navy. But if I were to be separated based on my identity alone, then I am left trying to figure out where I'm going to work next, where my family's going to live, where we're going to get insurance.
--:-- Noel King: That's a really tough situation. And what about the idea that being trans is somehow contrary to the values of the military?
--:-- Sam Rodriguez: That statement makes me feel really mad, sad, everything right because our nation is built on the values of freedom and service and sacrifice. My core values in the Navy are honor, courage, and commitment, and I have given nine years of honorable service with honor, courage, and commitment and integrity.
--:-- Noel King: Sam, can you recite the Navy's creed for us?
--:-- Sam Rodriguez: I am United States Sailor. I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States of America, and I will obey the orders of those appointed over me. I represent the fighting spirit of the Navy and those who have gone before me to defend freedom and democracy around the world. I proudly serve my country's Navy combat team with honor, courage, and commitment. I am committed to excellence and the fair treatment of all.
--:-- Noel King: That's really powerful, Sam. Thank you for sharing your story with us today.
--:-- Sam Rodriguez: Thanks for having me on the show.
--:-- Noel King: Support for Today Explained comes from Adio. Adio is an AI-native customer relationship management platform that says it's built for the next era of companies.
--:-- Noel King: Welcome back to Today Explained. We're talking about the Pentagon's new policy on transgender service members. I'm Noel King here with Haley Britsky.
--:-- Haley Britsky: Thanks for having me back on the show.
--:-- Noel King: Haley, what's the latest on the legal challenges to this policy?
--:-- Haley Britsky: We're still waiting to see how this plays out in court. But it's worth noting that the Defense Department was given a Saturday deadline to answer some questions from the courts, which included things like how much money has the department spent on some of these procedures and how many people are included under this definition.
--:-- Noel King: That's a pretty tight deadline. And what about the potential for this policy to be reversed?
--:-- Haley Britsky: It's unclear at this point where it's going to go. But it's certainly something that is playing out in the courts.
--:-- Noel King: Thanks for updating us on this story, Haley.
--:-- Haley Britsky: Thanks for having me back on the show.
--:-- Noel King: That's it for today's show. Thanks for listening to Today Explained. I'm Noel King.
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