--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Support for Today Explained comes from BetterHelp. Let me tell you a true story. Last weekend, I got an email from a listener who wanted to discuss their problems with me. And I said, look, I don't think that this is about me personally. At least I hope it's not. Why don't you try BetterHelp.com slash Explained? Absolute truth. As the largest online therapy provider in the world, BetterHelp can provide access to mental health professionals with a diverse variety of expertise. Find the one with BetterHelp. The one is not me, guys. Our listeners get 10% off their first month at BetterHelp.com slash explain. That's BetterHelp.com slash explained.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: We all have moments where we could have done better, like cutting your own hair. Yikes. Or forgetting sunscreen, so now you look like a tomato. Ouch. Could have done better. Same goes for where you invest. Level up and invest smarter with Schwab. Get market insights, education, and human help when you need it. Learn more at schwab.com. 2021 was another doozy of a year for the planet, for the climate. There was the record-shattering heat dome in the Pacific Northwest and just north in Canada. Police in Vancouver have responded to more than 130 sudden deaths since Friday. Heat is thought to have been a contributing factor in most cases.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: There were droughts, as well as record-breaking floods in Europe and Asia. The death toll from those devastating floods in Western Europe has climbed to more than 180, but it's expected to go much higher. And there were wildfires just about everywhere. Algeria's Kabil region is known for its lush mountains and forests, but scorching summer temperatures have reduced the trees to kindling. It's one of 16 provinces in the North African country that's been hit by wildfires since Monday.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And then there was a high-stakes climate conference in Glasgow. Welcome to COP. Welcome to Glasgow. We covered COP26 on the show back in November with Umair Irfan at Vox. The big goal is to have everybody at the table come forward with stronger commitments, ideally in line with what the Paris Agreement set out. And on the show today, we're going to hear from someone else who was there, who witnessed its failings and still remains hopeful somehow. A climate justice activist from Kampala, Uganda, named Vanessa Nakate.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: Humanity will not be saved by promises. It's hard to believe business and finance leaders when they haven't delivered before. They have not been faithful in their promises. They have not been honest in fulfilling their commitments. They have not been trustworthy in making their pledges a reality.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: I asked Vanessa how it felt to be a comparatively young person fighting for climate justice among the most powerful old people in the world. She said it was exhausting. It's always exhausting to do activism. I can speak for myself. Activism is a lot of work. And I think it's really important, you know, when activists take some time off to rest, you know, some time for self-care. Because I believe that we can better take care of the planet if we ourselves are doing well.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: So that's the first thing she did when she got back home to Kampala. I've just really been resting. Because of so much work that was, you know, being done at the COP, when I got home, I just chose to rest and get my strength and, you know, my energy back to push even harder for the coming year.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And for people who aren't familiar with you or your climate justice activism, tell me what about it can be so exhausting? What are you fighting for? The climate crisis is making it impossible for many people, for many communities to adapt. When people lose their homes to rising sea levels, when people lose their homes to landslides, these are things that they cannot get back.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: A new home can be provided or a space in a camp to live can be provided. But it isn't the same as a home. You know, when people lose their histories, they cannot be, you know, got back or their cultures. When we talk about the food insecurity that is rising because of the intensive droughts, because of the flooding that is washing away, you know, crops from people's farms, it means that many people won't be able to access food to eat.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: It means that many people face a risk of starving to death. So you cannot adapt to starvation. You cannot adapt to, you know, extinction of species of animals. And that is what the climate crisis is doing in so many communities at the front lines. And did you feel like the leaders of the world fully heard all that at COP26? Did they understand these issues the way you, you know, presented them?
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: Maybe they were hard because we as activists, you know, we continued speaking in and outside the COP and using every platform and every opportunity that we got to talk about these issues. It is not our job. Still, we have to be here. We have to ask our government to do action, which is their work.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: It's one thing to be heard, but it's another thing for what you've said to be considered or for action, you know, to be taken after what you have demanded for. So I am sure that, you know, many voices that spoke about climate justice, that spoke about, you know, loss and damage, they were heard. But then the outcome, you know, of the conference shows us that everything that we were saying or what we were demanding for, you know, was not considered.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: I believe that many world leaders here are here for the show of being here. I don't think they actually care. I don't think it affects them enough for them to care. We saw a climate tracker show that we are on a pathway of 2.4 degrees Celsius, you know, which is a death sentence for so many communities, which is devastation for so many people across the world.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: This is what we saw come out of the COP And again it just feels like you know it was more empty promises you know more empty you know conferences more empty phrases or clever and persuasive speeches that didn really amount to anything The COP has turned into a PR event where leaders are giving beautiful speeches and announcing fancy commitments and targets. While behind the curtains, the governments of the Global North countries are still refusing to take any drastic climate action.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: Commitments will not save the planet, or plagues will not stop the warming of our planet, and promises will not stop the suffering of people. So it was really important for, you know, governments, leaders to understand that only real action, only real action would give us the change that we were asking for and demanding for. But we didn't get to see that, you know, with the outcome of the COP.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: China and the United States have announced they'll work together to keep temperature rises below 1.5 degrees Celsius. But the world's two biggest polluters have not given further details. More than 100 nations agreed to cut methane emissions by 30 percent. But countries with major agricultural industries such as Australia and China didn't sign up. They also failed to join a commitment by 40 countries to phase out coal power.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: Now that you've had a few weeks to rest and to look back on this huge conference that had these huge goals and fell short of them, what do you think of this process of getting the world leaders together to make these sort of piecemeal agreements about the biggest problem the planet is facing? Do you think there's a better way?
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: Well, I think that, you know, the way has been very clear from the beginning. And this is what the young people or everyone else who is going to the streets, everyone else who is organizing and mobilizing. This is the way that, you know, we have been showing the leaders and governments, you know, showing them, you know, what the science is saying, showing them what communities are experiencing.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Honestly, I can't think of any other way to talk about the urgency of, you know, the climate crisis, especially in the most affected areas. So I think that, you know, me as an activist, probably other activists will just continue, you know, organizing and mobilizing and hoping that another world is possible for all of us.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: So I can't say that, you know, there is a new specific strategy that will get leaders to listen. Leaders are listening to us. Governments are listening to us. But it will take, you know, political will for us to see the change that we are demanding for. And this change will be pushed by the people. This change will be pushed by the power of the people who continue to organize and mobilize and just go to the streets and demand for climate justice.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So there is hope because people haven't given up yet. How Vanessa went from being ridiculed in the streets of Kampala to shaming the most powerful people in the world for their empty promises, in a minute on Today Explained.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Support for Today Explained comes from Built Rewards. These days, it seems like everybody has a rewards program. You swipe your card and you get one cent on the hundred dollars. But with your rent, frequently, you just pay month after month. You never get anything from it other than that roof over your head. Not anymore, says Built Rewards.
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--:-- Sean Rameswaram: You can eat at your favorite local restaurants, then earn more points. You can get VIP treatment at certain fitness studios. You can enjoy exclusive experiences just for Built members every month. When you're ready to travel, they say Built points can be converted to miles or hotel points all around the world.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: You can earn points on rent and around your neighborhood wherever you call home by joining built.com slash explained. That's J-O-I-N-B-I-L-T dot com slash explained.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Support for this show comes from Macy's. It's almost fall, and that means it's time to cycle your wardrobe to the cold setting. Because while everyone loves a breezy summer outfit, let's be real, layering is even more fun. That's why Macy's Fall Fashion Guide has everything you need to piece together the perfect look for you.
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--:-- Sean Rameswaram: I am here to say, prove us wrong. I'm actually here to beg you to prove us wrong. God help us all if you fail to prove us wrong. God help us. Thank you.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: How old are you, Vanessa? Can I ask that? Is that rude? No, it's fine. I just turned 25. Incredible. Incredible. You've done so much and you're just 25 years old. How did you get to be a climate activist?
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: Well, before I was a climate activist, I was about to graduate at Makere University Business School. It's in Kampala in Uganda. And I had studied business administration and majored in marketing. So before climate activism I can say that I was a marketing student who was looking forward to doing a master in business administration after my bachelor degree I graduated in 2019 So a few months before that was in 2018 I started to do a lot of research about some of the challenges that people were facing.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: In Uganda, the parliament has declared a state of emergency as the effects of the prolonged drought persist. It is a tough experience for persons affected by the recent River Nyamwamba floods in Kasese. According to the head of victims, Kisuki Mostafu, they've not had food for the last months. We found about 30,000 people suffering with no food.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: The government says five and a half million people are battling food shortages. This means one in every seven Ugandans needs food assistance. And Uganda as a country heavily depends on agriculture for survival, especially for so many people in the rural communities. So a lack of rain means drying of crops of so many people. It means starvation for so many people.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And also too much rain means destruction of farms or destruction of homes or destruction of businesses or destruction of schools and hospitals. And these are some of the things that we are already seeing happening in Uganda. So tell me how you begin in activism. You see all of these catastrophic climate events in Uganda. And then what do you do?
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: When I see these events and everything that I was, you know, reading from my research, I decided to find ways of creating awareness and being of help and just demanding for climate action and it was at the time that I saw the climate strikes that were started by Greta. So when school started in August this year I decided that this was enough. I sat myself down on the ground outside the Swedish parliament. I school striked for the climate.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Some people say that I should be in school instead. Some people say that I should study to become a climate scientist so that I can solve the climate crisis. But the climate crisis has already been solved. We already have all the facts and solutions. All we have to do is to wake up and change.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: But then I was scared. And, you know, I was scared in the beginning to do the climate strikes because I've always been quite a shy person. And it's always been very hard for me to easily interact with people or to stand in front of people. And this meant standing on the street and having a placard and just having all this attention on you and so many people looking.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So it would be embarrassing. And it would also, you know, be what students would call a walk of shame. Was that because it's just really unusual to see a young woman doing activism in Uganda?
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: I think so. Indeed, when I started activism, there was so much, you know, mocking from some of my former schoolmates or classmates, you know, mocking and laughing because they thought what I was doing was embarrassing.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So I was scared of all those things and the reactions from people. The comments that I saw myself when I had just started in those first weeks and months, some of these comments were, you know, people saying how I was going to the streets to attract men or if I was looking for a husband, I should just say that instead of, you know, standing on the streets and pretending to be an activist.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: And I remember comments like me being, me being, I'm trying to find, I was phrasing it, but it was more of me taking weed and that's what was taking me to the streets and some called it prostitution, disguised as climate activism.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: People thought you were on drugs or trying to engage in sex work because you were trying to do activism?
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: Yeah. Oh my goodness. All the youth in Africa, I call upon you to rise up and ask for what they lose to you. A few months after starting activism, I started feeling so frustrated about everything that was happening.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: I felt like activists continued to go out every Friday and strike and, you know, organize throughout the weeks. And I saw that the disasters of the climate crisis continued to happen and people continued to suffer. And I also saw that leaders continued to stay silent and not do anything about the climate crisis.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: The time is now for our leaders to take climate action and to fight against the crisis that we are facing right now. I call upon all state leaders of Africa to declare climate emergency in their respective countries. We have 54 countries in Africa, but none has declared climate emergency yet.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: So it was a place of, you know, feeling that what we were demanding for, we will never be able to see or we will never be able to achieve because the leaders won't do anything about it. Now is the time to act and demand for climate action. Thank you.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So how do you go from like, you know, an activist group of one to giving speeches to the most powerful people in the world? Well, in those weeks, I just kept sharing my work and what I was doing on social media.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: And one of the first invitation that I got it was an invitation from the United Nations to the Youth Climate Summit which was in New York in 2019 and I remember asking why I had got the invitation and I remember being told that some people were following my work and they were impressed by the work that I was doing in my country
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And after that, I remember also going for the COP25. I got an invitation to go for COP25 in Spain and then the World Economic Forum in Davos.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: We do not want to reach the tipping point of irreversibility of climate change. And we do not want to leave behind to the next generations an ever more hostile and ever less haptical world.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So you reach this global platform, which sounds like this incredible success from, you know, feeling so isolated and alone when you first started out as an activist. But then you get to the World Economic Forum in Davos and wind up speaking alongside some pretty well-known climate activists, only to find yourself cut out of the actual news coverage.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: She posed for a photo with other activists in Davos, Switzerland. She was the only black woman among the five. And when the Associated Press published the photo, there were only four faces. They cropped her out of the picture. Vanessa Nakate tweeted, You didn't just erase a photo, you erased a continent. But I am stronger than ever.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Tell me about that experience. I got an invitation to be at this press conference with other activists from Europe. So, really pleased to introduce in this order, Isabel Axelson, Lukina Till, Vanessa Nakate, Greta Thunberg, Luisa Neubauer.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: And I remember this press conference, you know, talking about the experience, you know, of so many people on the African continent when it comes to the climate crisis, emphasizing the importance of, you know, listening to activists from the most affected areas.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: We need to look at climate justice from every perspective because we all have a story to tell. But then later on, I, you know, I see this article and I find myself, you know, cropped out because I was sure that I was in the picture and, you know, my message not included in the article.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: So of course, it was frustrating because I was thinking about what I had really emphasized in the press conference and literally seeing that the opposite had been done and I was removed from this picture.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: What did it mean to you to be cropped out of this photo? Why do you think it happened?
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: This is something that I would call a problem that is in a system that decides who deserves to be listened to and who, you know, who doesn't deserve to be listened. So I think that's what happened.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Well, let's listen to what you had to say that day. Why do you think it is that it is taking a young panel like yourself to actually get them to listen to these problems? And do you also think that you actually are being listened to? Or do you think that they're sort of seeing you as a novelty that is good to listen to, but they're not actually going to take in anything that you say?
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: One thing I'm sure of is that they are listening to us they listen to us but they either choose to ignore or to do something about the demands that we are requesting for and for the business leaders and the people in power they have the authority and all the guts to save us from this planet so we've done all we've had to do but it's all up to them but one thing I'm sure of is that they're listening to us.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: If they don't act, it's because they're ignoring it. So the world is now listening, but the question is, will the world act?
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: You know, after your early ups and downs and ups and downs in this fight, what do you think it will take for something significant to happen? Will things just have to get significantly worse than they are now?
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: The truth is that we don't need a specific, you know, climate disaster to show leaders that we are in a serious challenge or in a serious problem. I remember someone asking me whether, you know, we were doomed because of the climate crisis. And I remember, you know, telling them that when you ask that question, to me, it comes from a place of privilege.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So it's more of, you know, you're asking whether we are going to be doomed without considering that there are so many communities that are already suffering some of the worst impacts of the climate crisis. We are facing the same storm of this crisis, but we are definitely in different boats.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: So we don't need a specific climate disaster to show that we are doomed. People are already experiencing intense droughts, floods, landslides, you know, hurricanes and cyclones that are devastating the lives of so many communities, that are devastating the futures of so many children and, you know, so many people.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So the climate crisis is already evident. The science available is already evident, you know, and we as activists, we continue to speak up. So I think that, you know, what we just need to do is to just keep the momentum, is to keep demanding for climate justice and not give up.
--:-- Vanessa Nakate: Because in the end, the power of the people will always win.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Vanessa Nakate is a climate justice activist based in Kampala, Uganda. She's the author of A Bigger Picture, My Fight to Bring a New African Voice to the Climate Crisis.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Our episode today was produced by Matthew Collette, edited by Jillian Weinberger, engineered by Paul Mounsey, and fact-checked by Laura Bullard and Miles Bryan.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: I'm Sean Rameswaram for him. It's Today Explained. Bye.
