--:-- [Theme music fades out]
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Welcome to The Journal, our show about money, business, and power. I'm Ryan Knutson.
--:-- Jessica Mendoza: And I'm Jessica Mendoza. It's Friday, March 14th.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Today, we're going to talk about Gloria Allred's lifelong crusade against men accused of sexual misconduct. She's a high-profile feminist lawyer, but little is known about what happens between Allred and her clients, mostly women, behind the scenes.
--:-- Jessica Mendoza: That's right. We've spoken to dozens of people, including former clients, lawyers, and people who've approached Allred's firm. And what they've told us is that Allred's public image is at odds with their experience behind the scenes.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Gloria Allred is one of America's best-known lawyers. Women have found their power, and they're not going to be silent anymore. They're going to stand up for themselves.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] Truth matters. Women matter. Those who allege that they were victims of sexual misconduct or sexual assault by Mr. Trump matter.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Allred has a reputation as a tough and tireless advocate for her clients. And she's represented women against powerful men, like Harvey Weinstein, R. Kelly, Bill Cosby, and Donald Trump.
--:-- Jessica Mendoza: But some of Allred's clients have a different story to tell. Caroline Wallner became a client of Allred's firm in 2021. And she claimed that Allred's firm didn't properly investigate her allegations and later tried to prevent her from speaking out.
--:-- Caroline Wallner: So do you regret working with Gloria Allred's law firm? Absolutely. It's been like the scariest rollercoaster ride with this because, you know, when you feel like, you know, people are starting to understand. And then all of a sudden you get like even more scared than you were before because they're constantly trying to put a muzzle on you.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Caroline spoke with Allred's legal partner, Nathan Goldberg. And what happened surprised her.
--:-- Caroline Wallner: When she told him Gaiman's lawyer's name, he told her that he actually knew that lawyer and he would call him. And, you know, I don't think after that conversation, I really ever got to go into the sex abuse and what had happened.
--:-- Nathan Goldberg: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Caroline signed a settlement with Gaiman, which included a non-disclosure agreement, or NDA. And she was asked to destroy photos, texts, and videos she sent to Gaiman.
--:-- Caroline Wallner: I did not know what a lot of it even meant. And we didn't go over the NDA together at all.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Caroline tried to move on with her life, but last summer, she listened to a podcast that changed all that. It was called Master, the Allegations Against Neil Gaiman.
--:-- Caroline Wallner: Oh, completely sick. I mean, what happened to us was different, very different, but so much of it was the same.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Caroline began to feel strongly that she should speak out about what happened to her.
--:-- Caroline Wallner: The only way to take care of yourself when you've experienced a trauma is to talk about it. And to come, you know, to terms with it and try to understand that it was not your fault.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Caroline wanted to speak out publicly and support the women. But Allred's firm told her that she couldn't break her NDA.
--:-- Caroline Wallner: I was, I mean, I was totally crying. I was crying so hard because it was really, it was aggressive. It was an aggressive phone call.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Caroline eventually hired a different lawyer to send a letter to Allred's firm alleging malpractice.
--:-- Caroline Wallner: It just felt really kind of like I don't know what the word is for something like that. Like Machiavellian or something.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Caroline and Gaiman have now both filed arbitration claims against the other for breaching the terms of their NDA.
--:-- Jessica Mendoza: Allred said she can't respond to specific client allegations because of ethics rules and other legal reasons.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: But Caroline told Khadija that looking back at her experience with Allred's firm, she wished she'd been encouraged to go to the police.
--:-- Caroline Wallner: There's a problem with signing an NDA, and that is with somebody who is a serial predator, and that is that you protect them, because you have to be silent about that, so you don't go on the record.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Khadija spoke with dozens of people who felt silenced or let down by Allred.
--:-- Jessica Mendoza: Effie's story is next. We'll be right back.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Welcome back to The Journal. We're talking about Gloria Allred's firm and how some of her clients have felt silenced or let down.
--:-- Jessica Mendoza: We're joined now by Khadija Safdar, who has been investigating this story.
--:-- Khadija Safdar: Thanks for having me.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: So, Khadija, what did you find out about Gloria Allred's firm?
--:-- Khadija Safdar: Well, we spoke to dozens of people, including former clients, lawyers, and people who've approached Allred's firm. And what they've told us is that Allred's public image is at odds with their experience behind the scenes.
--:-- Jessica Mendoza: That's right. We've also spoken to Caroline Wallner, who claimed that Allred's firm didn't properly investigate her allegations and later tried to prevent her from speaking out.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: And we've also spoken to Effie, who was a client of Allred's firm in 2021.
--:-- Effie: I was speaking out about my rape and a lot. A lot of people were recommending that I get a lawyer, and a lot of those people were recommending Gloria specifically because, you know, she's known as this, like, feminist icon that, like, helps victims and protects victims and fights for victims' rights.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie became a client of Allred's firm in 2021, and like Caroline, she was asked to sign a retainer agreement with the forced arbitration clause.
--:-- Effie: I requested that the law firm remove it, but they refused.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up signing the agreement. Allred would help Effie pro bono to provide evidence to law enforcement and act as her media spokesperson when and if needed.
--:-- Effie: It didn't include settlement negotiations or filing a lawsuit.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie didn't sue Hammer, but she did file a police report, and Allred helped Effie provide evidence to the police.
--:-- Jessica Mendoza: The L.A. district attorney in 2023 decided not to bring charges against Hammer.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: But during the criminal investigation, Allred told Effie that she shouldn't speak publicly.
--:-- Effie: So Gloria telling me to not talk, and she actually had me take down the screenshots from my Instagram of the messages that went viral, which felt very silencing because I had just finally started finding my voice.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] Maybe they would license photos of you alone, but I mean, that's what we call the money shot.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie pushed back, saying she didn't want to make any money from her experience.
--:-- Effie: No, it's not my goal to make money off of any of those.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she never sold her story or licensed any photos to a media outlet.
--:-- Effie: And then she kept, you know, saying that I have to make a decision and like badgering me about you have to make all these decisions.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie ended up doing a press conference, which was held online in March 2021.
--:-- Effie: So it was very scary for me. It was very like, she steered me into that direction.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On a call about a month later, Effie told Allred she was suffering panic attacks.
--:-- Effie: It was because I was having a bad, like, oh, come on, get a hold of yourself, all right? How old are you? 24. Get a hold of yourself.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: Effie said she wanted to speak out for herself, and Allred offered options.
--:-- Effie: She and I spoke on a call, and Effie shared a recording with Khadija.
--:-- Ryan Knutson: On the call, Allred presented Effie with options, like interviews that would include Allred, a potential movie deal, and also licensing photos of the victim with the accused.
--:-- Gloria Allred: [audio clip] I'm giving you my tough love.
