--:-- [Theme music fades out]
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Welcome back to Today Explained. I'm Sean Rameswaram.
--:-- Noel King: And I'm Noel King.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Today, we're talking about organ donation, specifically kidney donation. Our guest is Dylan Matthews, host of Vox's Future Perfect podcast.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Thanks for having me on the show.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Dylan, you recently donated a kidney to a stranger. What inspired you to do that?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: I've been thinking about donating a kidney for a while. I first read about it in an article in The New Yorker when I was 19. It just seemed like an obvious thing to do if you have an extra kidney and someone needs one.
--:-- Noel King: That's really interesting. Can you walk us through the process of donating a kidney?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Sure. I had to go through a series of tests to make sure my kidney was healthy and that I was a good candidate for donation. Then, I had to meet with a social worker, a psychologist, and a kidney specialist to make sure I was making an informed decision.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what was the surgery like?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: It was a pretty straightforward procedure. I had to go under general anesthesia, and then the surgeon made three small incisions in my abdomen to remove my kidney.
--:-- Noel King: Wow, that sounds intense. How long did it take to recover?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: It took about a week or two to recover from the surgery. I had to do a lot of walking and coughing exercises to help my body heal.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what about the risks involved? We've heard that there's a small chance of complications.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yeah, there is a small risk of complications, but it's relatively low. The risk of death in surgery is about 1 in 10,000.
--:-- Noel King: That's reassuring. But what about the long-term risks? Can you still get kidney problems after donating a kidney?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yes, there is a small risk of kidney problems, but it's relatively low. Studies have shown that people who donate kidneys have a lower risk of kidney failure than the general population.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: That's good to know. And what about the recipient? How did you find out about them?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: I didn't find out about the recipient until after the surgery. But I did get to meet them later, and it was a really meaningful experience.
--:-- Noel King: That's amazing. Can you tell us more about that?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yeah, sure. I got to meet the recipient, Amit, and his family. They were really grateful for the kidney, and it was a really emotional experience for me.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: That's so cool. And what about the logistics of the donation? How did you coordinate everything?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: It was actually pretty straightforward. I worked with a team at Johns Hopkins Hospital to coordinate the donation. They took care of everything from the surgery to the follow-up care.
--:-- Noel King: Wow, that sounds like a really well-oiled machine. And what about the cost? Did you have to pay anything out of pocket?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: No, I didn't have to pay anything out of pocket. My employer, Vox, has unlimited medical leave, which was a huge help.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: That's great. And what about the idea of paying people to donate kidneys? Some people think that's a good idea, while others think it's a bad one.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yeah, that's a really interesting topic. I think it's a complex issue, but I do think that paying people to donate kidneys could be a good way to increase the supply of organs.
--:-- Noel King: That's a really interesting perspective. Can you explain why you think that?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yeah, sure. I think that paying people to donate kidneys could help to increase the supply of organs, which is a huge problem in the US. Right now, there are thousands of people on the waiting list for a kidney transplant.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: That's right. And what about the idea of a "kidney market"? Some people think that's a good idea, while others think it's a bad one.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yeah, that's a really interesting topic. I think that a kidney market could be a good way to increase the supply of organs, but it would also require a lot of regulation to make sure that it's fair and safe for everyone involved.
--:-- Noel King: That's a really good point. And what about the idea of Medicare for All? Some people think that's a good idea, while others think it's a bad one.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yeah, that's a really interesting topic. I think that Medicare for All could be a good way to increase access to healthcare, including organ transplants.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: That's a really interesting perspective. Can you explain why you think that?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yeah, sure. I think that Medicare for All could help to increase access to healthcare, including organ transplants, which would be a huge benefit for people who need them.
--:-- Noel King: That's a really good point. And finally, what advice would you give to someone who is considering donating a kidney?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: I would say that it's a really personal decision, and you should do what feels right for you. But if you're considering it, I would say that it's a really rewarding experience.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: That's great advice. Thanks, Dylan, for sharing your story with us today.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Thanks for having me on the show.
--:-- Noel King: And thanks to our listeners for tuning in. If you want to try out KiwiCo's educational projects for kids, you can go to KiwiCo.com slash explained.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And if you want to learn more about Dylan's podcast, Future Perfect, you can check it out on Vox.com.
--:-- Noel King: Thanks for listening, and we'll see you tomorrow.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: [Theme music starts playing]
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: We're back with a quick update. KiwiCo is offering our listeners a chance to try out their educational projects for free. Just go to KiwiCo.com slash explained.
--:-- Noel King: And if you want to learn more about KiwiCo's projects, you can check them out on their website.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Thanks to KiwiCo for supporting our show.
--:-- Noel King: And thanks to our listeners for tuning in.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: We'll see you tomorrow.
--:-- Noel King: [Theme music continues to play]
--:-- Amit: Hey, it's Amit.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Hey, Amit. How are you doing?
--:-- Amit: Great. How are you?
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Great. You're my colleague, but we've never met.
--:-- Amit: Yeah, I don't even know.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Are you based in New York?
--:-- Amit: No, I'm based in D.C.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Okay. All right. But you're based in New York.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And you have children.
--:-- Amit: Yeah, I do. We have 12 and 15-year-old girls.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: That's great. And I heard that they're fans of KiwiCo's projects.
--:-- Amit: Yeah, yeah. Exactly. Like, some things resonate, some things don't. You know, like, there's, like, sort of different personalities.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Yeah, I know what you mean.
--:-- Amit: Like the doodle crate is a little bit more artsy. And so one of our girls was like, oh, really into arts and crafts.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Yeah, yeah.
--:-- Amit: And the other one is like a little more tinkery in terms of like science experiments and stuff like that.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Yeah, that makes sense.
--:-- Amit: So, you know, she wanted sort of the more engineering style ones.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Yeah, that's great.
--:-- Amit: But you did this all, you got your KiwiCo subscription in an era before Today Explained existed, is that?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Oh, yeah, yeah. No, for sure.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: But the thing is now that I know about it, I sort of like recommend it to friends.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yeah, and you can tell your friends when you tell them that they can go to KiwiCo.com slash explained to try KiwiCo out for free.
--:-- Amit: Yeah, that's true.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: How about you? You have kids or anything?
--:-- Amit: No. Sorry, I just got you.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Dylan, as a person who has had some bad experiences with surgeries, I am not afraid to admit that surgeries kind of scare me.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: I don't think I'm alone in this world that surgeries scare me.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: It's not like donating blood. You weren't scared of surgery?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yeah, I'm a weird person in certain ways, and so I was probably less scared of it than the average person.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Like when I got my wisdom teeth out, I had them knock me out because I wanted to watch them do it and see how they did it.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: And if you don't have that kind of relationship to surgery, it seems scarier, but it's really not that bad.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And you do have to go under, you're under general anesthetic, and everything that that entails.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: But you're out of the hospital in a few days.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: I came out and stuff hurt for a while, but things were still basically all right.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Okay, so as a weird person who's okay with being in a somewhat painful situation, are you comfortable assessing the risks of a kidney surgery?
--:-- Amit: Yeah, I think it would. People do wild stuff for money, man.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Right. Like much more dangerous.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: We allow people to be like loggers and big catch fishermen in Alaska.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: There was a good paper that some folks at Duke did comparing the legality of the National Football League and the illegality of kidney compensation.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Based on all we know, being an NFL player is so much worse for your house than donating a kidney.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Like it's not even comparable.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: And we've agreed that because you've got a ton of money for doing it, not only are we going to allow this, but we're going to allow a whole secondary industry where you get paid nothing in college to do this in hopes that you might one day make some money doing this professionally.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: That's a decision we've made as a society.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: That's a physical risk we're willing to let people take in exchange for enough money.
--:-- Noel King: Dylan, as a person who has had some bad experiences with surgeries, I am not afraid to admit that surgeries kind of scare me.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: I don't think I'm alone in this world that surgeries scare me.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: It's not like donating blood. You weren't scared of surgery?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yeah, I'm a weird person in certain ways, and so I was probably less scared of it than the average person.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Like when I got my wisdom teeth out, I had them knock me out because I wanted to watch them do it and see how they did it.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: And if you don't have that kind of relationship to surgery, it seems scarier, but it's really not that bad.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And you do have to go under, you're under general anesthetic, and everything that that entails.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: But you're out of the hospital in a few days.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: I came out and stuff hurt for a while, but things were still basically all right.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Okay, so as a weird person who's okay with being in a somewhat painful situation, are you comfortable assessing the risks of a kidney surgery?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yeah, I think it would. People do wild stuff for money, man.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Right. Like much more dangerous.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: We allow people to be like loggers and big catch fishermen in Alaska.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: There was a good paper that some folks at Duke did comparing the legality of the National Football League and the illegality of kidney compensation.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Based on all we know, being an NFL player is so much worse for your house than donating a kidney.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Like it's not even comparable.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: And we've agreed that because you've got a ton of money for doing it, not only are we going to allow this, but we're going to allow a whole secondary industry where you get paid nothing in college to do this in hopes that you might one day make some money doing this professionally.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: That's a decision we've made as a society.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: That's a physical risk we're willing to let people take in exchange for enough money.
--:-- Noel King: Dylan, as a person who has had some bad experiences with surgeries, I am not afraid to admit that surgeries kind of scare me.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: I don't think I'm alone in this world that surgeries scare me.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: It's not like donating blood. You weren't scared of surgery?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yeah, I'm a weird person in certain ways, and so I was probably less scared of it than the average person.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Like when I got my wisdom teeth out, I had them knock me out because I wanted to watch them do it and see how they did it.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: And if you don't have that kind of relationship to surgery, it seems scarier, but it's really not that bad.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And you do have to go under, you're under general anesthetic, and everything that that entails.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: But you're out of the hospital in a few days.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: I came out and stuff hurt for a while, but things were still basically all right.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Okay, so as a weird person who's okay with being in a somewhat painful situation, are you comfortable assessing the risks of a kidney surgery?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yeah, I think it would. People do wild stuff for money, man.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Right. Like much more dangerous.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: We allow people to be like loggers and big catch fishermen in Alaska.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: There was a good paper that some folks at Duke did comparing the legality of the National Football League and the illegality of kidney compensation.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Based on all we know, being an NFL player is so much worse for your house than donating a kidney.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Like it's not even comparable.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: And we've agreed that because you've got a ton of money for doing it, not only are we going to allow this, but we're going to allow a whole secondary industry where you get paid nothing in college to do this in hopes that you might one day make some money doing this professionally.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: That's a decision we've made as a society.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: That's a physical risk we're willing to let people take in exchange for enough money.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Now that you belong to like a community of people who have donated their kidneys, do you feel like, I mean, obviously there's like the privilege of health, but also was there another element of like your privilege that allowed you to do this?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Sure. There are a bunch of things that I was lucky to have that helped a lot.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Vox has unlimited medical leave. I didn't have any lost wages.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: That was a big privilege.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: I also was privileged to be in a job where I don't have to lift heavy objects.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: You can't lift anything over 10 pounds for several weeks after the surgery.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: If you're in a manual profession, if you're doing construction work, and also if you're a parent of small children who you have to pick up, that might not be something you're able to do.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: So I had the privilege of that not being a problem for me in my life.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And like to just the person on the street who might find out that you did this in conversation or like see a scar and ask you what that is.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: And they go like, whoa, you gave your kidney away. Like, why would you do that?
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Do you have like a stock answer? My elevator pitch?
--:-- Dylan Matthews: Yeah. It seemed like an easy way to help another person a lot.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And then they ask you about how easy it is, and I give my whole spiel about how it's not as bad as you think.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: But that's really the core answer, that it didn't cost me that much, and it helped this guy a lot.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: It helped his family a lot.
--:-- Dylan Matthews: And I don't know. That was enough for me.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Dylan Matthews is the host of the Future Perfect podcast at Vox.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: It's all about finding radical ways to make the world a better place.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: The second season has just commenced.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Its theme is philanthropy versus democracy.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: How all those billionaire donors who want to save the world might not actually be helping at all.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: If you're subscribed, episode one is waiting for you.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: It's about Andrew Carnegie, who gave America a whole lot of libraries so they'd forget all about his brutal steel mills.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: If you're not subscribed, well, we certainly can't be friends anymore.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: I kid. I kid.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Me. I'm Sean Rameswaram from This Is Today Explained.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Irene Noguchi, Bridget McCarthy, Afim Shapiro, Noam Hassenfeld, Amina Alsadi, and Halima Shah make the show.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: With a little extra help from Britt Hansen this week.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Siona Petros is the intern, is the intern, is the intern, and the mysterious breakmaster Cill and Deer makes music for us.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Today Explained is produced in association with Stitcher, and we're part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Monday's Memorial Day, so the show is back on Tuesday.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Thanks to KiwiCo for swinging by to support this podcast once more.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: The KiwiCo people are offering today Explain People the chance to try them out for free.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: To redeem the offer, all you got to do is go to KiwiCo.com slash explained.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Conveniently, the place where you can also learn more about KiwiCo's projects for kids of all ages.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Ciao for now.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Thanks to KiwiCo for supporting our show.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And thanks to our listeners for tuning in.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: We'll see you tomorrow.
--:-- Noel King: [Theme music continues to play]
