--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Welcome to Today Explained. I'm your host, Sean Rameswaram.
--:-- Laura Bullard: Hi, I'm Laura Bullard, senior researcher here at Today Explained.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Today, we're talking about a Minion meme that went viral on TikTok in a very unusual way. Laura, you investigated and connected the dots all the way to the 2024 election. Let's start with the meme. What was it about?
--:-- Laura Bullard: Minions are inescapable at this point. The movies have made over $5 billion. You can go to Minion Land in Orlando. You can decorate your house with Christmas Minions in December. You can buy Minion chicken nuggets at the grocery store. And lately, there's been a very strange but ubiquitous Minion meme on TikTok.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: What was the meme about?
--:-- Laura Bullard: There's a content creator who's sitting in front of a green screen. On the green screen is an image of a Minion who is crucified. It's a Minion crucifixion scene.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what's the content creator saying in the video?
--:-- Laura Bullard: The TikToker starts the video by saying, "One day an animator was messing around and he created this picture of a little Minion who was nailed to a cross." And you can see... And so like the gist of the video is basically like, this Minion didn't die on the cross for you, but someone did. Jesus actually died for you and took the punishment that you and I deserve. And why?
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And you started investigating this meme. Where did you start?
--:-- Laura Bullard: I started with the image, which, again, Minion crucifixion. And I noticed that in the bottom left corner of the image, there's like an artist signature. So I just found that guy on Facebook, incidentally, and I called him up.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And who was that guy?
--:-- Laura Bullard: His name is Ameriko Cruz. I am 26 years old and I am a graphic design student. I live in Saltillo, Coahuila, Mexico.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what did Ameriko Cruz tell you about creating the image?
--:-- Laura Bullard: He told me that he had actually just learned about these videos, but he had created this image back in 2021. I asked him what compelled him to make such a bizarre image. I honestly don't remember having a specific reason or motive to do it. The idea just came to my mind and I said, "Hey, I think it would be fun to create this illustration."
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: But this still didn't explain why you kept seeing videos with the same or very similar scripts over and over again. So you changed gears and you turned to the actual content of the video. Who were these people? How do they know each other? Are they friends? Are they working together towards a specific goal?
--:-- Laura Bullard: A couple of other publications have tried to solve this mystery, and they all sort of point back to the earliest known version of this video. The thought was that other Christian influencers sort of saw how well this was doing and they followed suit, more or less organically, just like pulling the image, pulling the script.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: But that didn't sound right to you. So you started combing through these social media accounts, and you realized there seemed to be one man that all of these people were following.
--:-- Laura Bullard: Jesus? Yes, but outside of that, because this would be on social media. Yeah. Including the original poster. All of these accounts were connected back to one man, and his name is Talon Michael Seaman.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Welcome back to Ruston, Louisiana. I'm your host, Evangelist Talon Michael. [Talon Michael Seaman appears on screen]
--:-- Talon Michael Seaman: If you would, let me know where you're watching from all over the world today.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So he's this guy in his late 20s. He's blonde. He's kind of buff. And he is an evangelist and a self-proclaimed millionaire.
--:-- Laura Bullard: He started this movement that he calls the Viral Revival, which has like rural juror vibes. It does. So you have to like say it slow.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: So you tried to sign up for his classes. What happened?
--:-- Laura Bullard: I basically what they said to me when you sign up is like your first training video. So I was like, "I'm in." Hi, welcome. If you're watching this right now, my name is Talen and you want to learn how to leave your nine to five job to preach the gospel full time online. Welcome to the party.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what did you realize at the end of the video?
--:-- Laura Bullard: I realized the rest of the course is paywalled. They do note that this was for my own good. But I want you to know one thing. There is a financial investment. So this isn't free because people who don't pay don't pay attention.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: But you were interested in paying for the class. What happened then?
--:-- Laura Bullard: Well, I was interested actually in paying for the class, but I found out that they actually screen the people before they decide who they're willing to allow and to pay them. So basically they screen for people who are like actually content creators who want to be evangelizing.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And did getting rejected from this class get you any closer to connecting the dots on this compelling image of a Minion on a crucifix and what the people were saying in the videos that you saw on TikTok?
--:-- Laura Bullard: Sort of. Like, he kind of told me how the business works and, like, what the coaches do. And he would not confirm or deny the Minion details specifically.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: But you were able to connect the dots with some other TikTokers. What did they tell you?
--:-- Laura Bullard: They were willing to confirm that this is content that was sort of flagged to them by their coaches. Yeah. Yeah. So the way the program works is basically like they are making content based on this sort of like marketing framework presented to them. And then the coaches are also making content. And if somebody makes something that is particularly successful, the coaches will then like tell that information to all the followers.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what's the end goal of each video?
--:-- Laura Bullard: The end goal of each video is to save you the viewer from hell. Jesus is real. If you know that it is time to let Jesus into your life, then pray this prayer with me. Say, Jesus, I am sorry for living a life of sin apart from you.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And there's a clear interest in making a lot of money. How much money is Talon Michael Seaman making?
--:-- Laura Bullard: The courses are expensive. That's like one way they're making money. They say they have like 800 people enrolled. So that means like without factoring in any like discounts, he's cleared anywhere from $1.6 to $7.2 million.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And is Talon Michael Seaman at the top of the pyramid, or does it go higher than that?
--:-- Laura Bullard: So, technically, his ministry is connected in a couple different ways to his church, where his father-in-law is the pastor. And this church seems to be either a part of or like extremely adjacent to something that is called the New Apostolic Reformation.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what is the New Apostolic Reformation?
--:-- Laura Bullard: It's a loose collection of non-denominational churches. They're connected by like people doing speaker circuits and a few key similarities. They're quasi-Pentecostal so you're going to hear like a lot of speaking in tongues. You're going to see faith healing and there is also this undeniable emphasis on wealth.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what's the connection between the New Apostolic Reformation and the 2024 election?
--:-- Laura Bullard: We'll get to that in a minute. But first, let's talk about the New Apostolic Reformation and its influence on American Christianity.
--:-- Andy Kroll: The New Apostolic Reformation is one of the most fascinating and troubling parts of American Christianity today. It is politically connected. It is very dramatic in how it talks about the role of the church and the role of Christianity.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And who is one of the key figures in the New Apostolic Reformation?
--:-- Andy Kroll: Lance Wallnau is one of the key figures in the New Apostolic Reformation. He's based out of Texas. He is not exactly a preacher. He's not exactly a pastor. He doesn't lead a church or have people who come to him on Sunday to hear him talk. He's something much bigger than that. He's an influencer.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what's Lance Wallnau's big idea?
--:-- Andy Kroll: Lance Wallnau's big idea is something called the Seven Mountain Mandate. In reality, it started with a conversation he had in the year 2000. He has a conversation, what he later says is this sort of aha moment for him, this divine revelation, truly, where he's talking with some peers in this world, And they come to this idea that there are seven key pillars of American society or seven key spheres of influence that basically decide what a culture looks like.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what are those seven spheres of influence?
--:-- Andy Kroll: Those are arts and media, business, religion, family, church, government, science and technology. Now these seven fields of influence are very powerful, so powerful in fact, that he who occupies the top of those mountains can literally shape the agenda that forms nations.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what's the goal of the Seven Mountain Mandate?
--:-- Andy Kroll: The goal of the Seven Mountain Mandate is to take dominion of these seven mountains. Because God has a way of getting into positions, companies, businesses, nations, and communities before the devil even knows what got in there.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what does this mean for American society?
--:-- Andy Kroll: This means that public education is destroyed, dismantled, taken apart, replaced by religious education. Homeschooling is a human right. And so homeschooling becomes far more part of the education system. You have a government that is run and shaped through a biblical worldview.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what does this mean for the future of the Republican Party?
--:-- Andy Kroll: I think this is the future of the Republican Party. If Trump, when Trump exits the stage, this is where the energy is, this sort of swirling of Christian memes and new apostolic reformation leaders and Republican politicians.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what's the connection between the Minion meme and the Seven Mountain Mandate?
--:-- Laura Bullard: I think the Minion meme is just a symptom of a larger problem. It's a symptom of a movement that's trying to use social media to spread its message and to recruit new followers.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And what's the takeaway from this story?
--:-- Andy Kroll: I think the takeaway from this story is that we need to be aware of the power of social media and the way it can be used to spread ideas and to recruit followers. We need to be aware of the ways in which these ideas can be used to shape our culture and our society.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: And finally, what's the connection between the Minion meme and the 2024 election?
--:-- Laura Bullard: We'll get to that in a minute. But for now, let's just say that the Minion meme is just the tip of the iceberg. There's a much larger movement at play here, and it's one that we need to be aware of.
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Thanks for joining us on Today Explained. I'm your host, Sean Rameswaram.
--:-- [Closing music plays]
--:-- Sean Rameswaram: Today's episode was produced by Amanda Lewellyn, reported and fact-checked by Laura Bullard, edited by Matt Collette, engineered by Andrea Kristinsdottir and Patrick Boyd, and hosted by Sean Rameswaram.
--:-- [Closing music continues to play]
