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--:-- **Podcast Introduction:**
--:-- Kara Swisher: Hi, everyone. This is Pivot from New York Magazine, the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Kara Swisher.
Scott Galloway: And I'm Scott Galloway.
--:-- Kara Swisher: And you're listening to our special three-part series on the future of travel, where we look at the business and tech trends that are impacting how we make our way through the world. We'll be covering planes, trains, and yes, automobiles.
--:-- Scott Galloway: Today, we're hitting the rails to tackle trains at a pivotal time for high-speed rail in this country. Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg recently said people have been dreaming of high-speed rail in America for decades. It's really happening this time. But is it?
--:-- Kara Swisher: Here to enlighten us about the future of train travel is Yonah Freemark. Yonah is a researcher at the Urban Institute and also writes the blog, The Transport Politic. Yonah, welcome.
--:-- Yonah Freemark: Thanks so much for having me.
--:-- **Discussion on High-Speed Rail:**
--:-- Scott Galloway: So, do you agree with Secretary Buttigieg that 2024 is the year that high-speed rail finally becomes a reality?
--:-- Yonah Freemark: Well, it all depends on the definition of being here when it comes to high-speed rail. The United States used to lead the world in terms of its intercity rail system. We had an enormous network of intercity trains that connected passengers from everywhere to everywhere, with frequent trains on major corridors. People relied on the intercity rail system to get them around.
--:-- Yonah Freemark: Running into World War II, there was a lot of optimism about the U.S. moving forward. In the post-war period, we started to see some acceleration of corridors like New York to Washington, D.C., with speeds up to 140 miles per hour. But I'm not sure this is the year for high-speed rail. However, we have seen major advancements from the federal administration pushing high-speed rail forward.
--:-- Kara Swisher: Why has it been so slow?
--:-- Yonah Freemark: After World War II, the U.S. chose to invest massively in the interstate highway system rather than the intercity railway system. This led to the degradation of the railway system, which had to be nationalized in the late 1960s, resulting in the creation of Amtrak.
--:-- Scott Galloway: To be fair, the highway system is better than in other countries.
--:-- Yonah Freemark: Yes, but there was a choice to invest in car travel over intercity rail. This was partly due to a fear that rail companies were oligarchic. The interstate highway system was seen as a progressive alternative.
--:-- **Global Comparisons and U.S. Challenges:**
--:-- Scott Galloway: Other countries have had fast trains for years. Japan's bullet train started in the 1960s, France's high-speed rail in the 1980s, and China's network is vast.
--:-- Yonah Freemark: The U.S. has struggled due to low investment in public transportation compared to highways. We've allowed metropolitan regions to spread out, making effective public transportation systems harder to build.
--:-- Kara Swisher: What's the biggest obstacle to making high-speed rail happen?
--:-- Yonah Freemark: It depends on the definition of a system. If we mean a national system like the interstate highway system, it could take decades. The U.S. lacks public sector capacity and long-term funding commitments.
--:-- **Sustainability and Future Predictions:**
--:-- Kara Swisher: How does sustainability factor into this?
--:-- Yonah Freemark: Transportation is the largest contributor to greenhouse gas emissions in the U.S. Rail systems can be easily powered by electricity, but the U.S. has been slow to electrify.
--:-- Scott Galloway: What's your prediction for high-speed rail in the next five to ten years?
--:-- Yonah Freemark: By 2030, we might see a high-speed rail corridor between Los Angeles and Las Vegas. If successful, it could spark interest in other regions.
--:-- Kara Swisher: What's your craziest prediction?
--:-- Yonah Freemark: Autonomous subway systems. The U.S. has the opportunity to automate its metro systems, similar to what's done in other countries.
--:-- Scott Galloway: Thanks for tuning in to part one of our series on the future of travel. Stay tuned for planes and automobiles.
--:-- Kara Swisher: Today's episode was produced by Lara Naiman, Zoe Marcus, and Taylor Griffin. Engineering by Ernie and Todd. Thanks to Drew Rose, Miel Saverio, and Nishat Kurwa, Vox Media's executive producer of audio.
--:-- Scott Galloway: Subscribe to the show wherever you listen to podcasts. Thanks for listening to Pivot from New York Magazine and Vox Media.
